EP 51: Navigating The Challenges Of A Multigenerational Workforce

CB_51. Karen McCullough: Audio automatically transcribed by Sonix

CB_51. Karen McCullough: this mp3 audio file was automatically transcribed by Sonix with the best speech-to-text algorithms. This transcript may contain errors.

Renee Thompson:
Plants thrive and grow in a peaceful, nourished environment, right? Well, it's the same with human beings. But what if that environment is not so peaceful? What if it's toxic? Welcome to Coffee Break: Breaking the Cycle of Bullying in Healthcare – One Cup at a Time. In this podcast, you'll get practical, evidence-based strategies to help you cultivate and sustain a healthy and respectful work culture by tackling an age-old problem in healthcare: bullying and incivility. I am your host, Dr. Renee Thompson.

Renee Thompson:
Hi, everyone! Welcome back to another episode of the Coffee Break podcast. Okay, you know this if you're listening: nurses eat their young. We've been saying that, I think, for a century now. However, sometimes it's the young eating the quote-unquote old. We've got baby boomers and Gen Xers, millennials, Gen Zs. They're all working together, but they're not always getting along. So today, we're excited that I invited a generation's expert, Karen McCullough, to help today's leaders actually overcome the challenges that they're facing right now leading a multigenerational team. Oh my gosh, Karen, thank you so much for being here. Welcome to the show.

Karen McCullough:
Oh, I'm excited to be here. Thanks for having me.

Renee Thompson:
So Karen and I met, I don't know, I think it was maybe five years ago. Karen and I are both members of the National Speakers Association, and we're both certified speaking professionals, And we met at a special summit that they host every year for CSPs. And I don't know, Karen was just so much fun. She's got such a great sense of humor, and I love her smile and her laugh, and she just made the summit funner than it would have been without her. And I think we stayed connected for a little while. But it was just a few weeks ago at the National, the conference, Influence, that we happen to be sitting there at the same table having lunch, and our mutual friend Lois Kramer was sitting there, and we started talking, and you said the phrase something about nurses eat their young. Wait, you know what that is?

Karen McCullough:
Yes.

Renee Thompson:
And unfortunately, yes, you do know what that is because you're not a nurse. You're not a healthcare leader. Let me tell you what Karen is. So, she's actually a nationally recognized keynote speaker with a unique approach to understanding generational diversity. She helps organizations, and a lot of them are healthcare organizations, navigate generational biases by harnessing their team's strength. She really believes that understanding generational differences can actually be truly advantageous like other forms of diversity. And she's been doing this work for more than 20 years and is truly a trusted advisor to, again, a lot of healthcare organizations. And what I love is that Karen, again, is not a nurse. She's not a physician. But yet, she understands what these healthcare leaders are facing. Karen, again, thank you so much for being here. Can you tell us a little bit about the generations? Let's kind of level set everything and talk about the different generations and what their stories are.

Karen McCullough:
Yeah, it's something I love and it's so interesting because I've been doing this a long time. And just when I'm ready to quit, another generation comes on the scene. I was really done at COVID. I said okay, we've heard enough about millennials. And then, lo and behold, Gen Z came along. And again, I'm again flooded with people curious about what to do. Let me just say, first off, that healthcare, they are very unique. They're very different than most organizations I speak to, and a lot of it is because they have to be there. Not only do they, there's no virtual when we're talking about hospitals, and also there's a lot of education. There's a lot of experience that goes into nursing in particular. And with that, there comes some sort of challenges, I think, with younger people coming on board. So, with that said, let me just give you a quick picture of the generations. And the way I like to do it is by telling you the generations' story because I feel like we take our story, the story that we have created during our formative years in our teens and early 20s, our values, so to speak, the way we look at work, the way we look at family, and we take that with us, and we take it into the workplace. Baby boomers, we have a unique story. I'm a baby boomer! And so if you think about it, these are people that are right now, I think the oldest boomer is like 75, 70, maybe 77, 70, I'm not sure. 1946 to 1964. I don't really care about the dates. I really care about is where our mental, our minds are. And with baby boomers, a lot of it is hard work. A lot of it is putting in the time. A lot of it is overtime. It's doing a great job. It's being proud of the work that we do and taking that whole feeling of competition and pride with us into the workplace. Think about my physician. She just retired, but she used to tell me stories about how those younger physicians, we were here day and night, I had to sleep in the hospital, and they're leaving. They're leaving at 5:00. And she just having a conversation with me was a little bit put off. Those are baby boomers. And then we have generation X, which generation X is more like a baby boomer in many ways. They have the work ethic of a baby boomer, but they also have the understanding of a millennial. The challenge with Gen X, this is the sandwich generation. We used to call them the bridge. 1965 to 1979 are the dates.

Renee Thompson:
Yeah, that's me. I'm an Xer.

Karen McCullough:
Yeah. Most people, I shouldn't say that in healthcare, because healthcare, we have a lot of boomers, but in most of my audiences, it's Gen X that I'm talking to. They've taken over the leadership roles in most corporations right now. They are the lead. The challenge with Gen X and I hate to say this, but Gen X, I hope you agree with me, is they are the just get-it-done generation. It's the figure out. Yeah, just go figure.

Renee Thompson:
Oh my gosh. I cannot tell you how many times I'm like, Oh my god, can we just get it done?

Karen McCullough:
And that mentality, it works with baby boomers. But as the millennial came on the scene, this was a big rub for them because they want to be guided. But you're a generation that is pretty no-nonsense. And you want to get the work done. And you've put the time in and you're all about productivity and quality, and you're not big on empathy and compassion. I don't mean to say that; some of you are. I don't mean to say, but let's just say overall. I have a line. If you're a leader, maybe you say something like, Hey, my door is always open, just don't come too often and don't stay too long. And I think that kind of sums it up. And when I'm speaking, most Gen Xers, agree.

Renee Thompson:
Yeah. I am right there with you. Yeah, I agree.

Karen McCullough:
My advice is to soften because millennials definitely are very different than you are. So now, let's just move into the millennial generation. This is really where my work exploded because people were trying to figure out millennials and when were they going to become just like us, and they didn't. 1965 to 1970 are the dates. Okay? They're old now. They're in their 40s. It's so interesting because they were the babies. But right now, many leadership roles are being held by this generation and they're challenged. The generation that has a big heart. It's a generation that wants purpose. They're looking for more than just a job. They're looking for completion, satisfaction. They're looking for really fulfilling another piece of them. They have a lot of empathy. They have a lot of compassion. The biggest challenge that I see that working with the millennials is they're challenged. They don't like to give bad news. They have a very hard time with feedback, with giving the feedback. They don't want to be the bad guy, but yet they want to get the job done. So we've got this generation that's brought in all of the new words. We've brought in compassion, we brought in empathy, we brought in diversity, inclusion, equity, all of the new words that we're now seeing on every website. All of this biggest shift came from Generation X. They're the shift generation. And now we have Generation Z. And Generation Z is totally different than Generation X. Generation Z's parents are, everybody hold on, Gen X. Just put the two together. You're going to start to see an edge. You're going to start to see a questioning. You're going to start to see a confidence the longer they're there and the more Generation Xers you have to speak up. They see the problems at work, and they want to tell you about them right away. I work with a lot of universities where they're teaching generation Z how to have a voice. And I said, you know what? That voice is hurting them in the workplace. They said, Oh, no, we're teaching them to not use it for the first six months. They've got to stay. And before they tell you everything wrong with work, they've got to begin to start to watch how things work. So we're challenged right now. We're challenged by these generations, and we're challenged by our belief. For me, it's the work ethic, hard work to people who are saying; We can get the work done easier, we can get it done faster, we can use technology, we don't have to do some of the systems that are in place. Let's speed these up. So we're seeing a huge shift in how we look at work.

Renee Thompson:
Okay. I just want to do a recap on those with the story. So, the baby boomers are the hard-working ones. Okay? They're the ones. And I actually want to talk about this. So I'm going to put that in the parking lot for a moment about how they don't understand other generations and how they're not as loyal and committed and all of that. And because that shows up in healthcare a lot. The Gen X, their hard work ethic, just like the baby boomers, but they're all about getting the work done. Okay, productivity. And it's funny, I just finished reading a book. I was on an airplane today. So I finished the book on the airplane. It was How to Buy Back Your Time by Dan, is it Martinell? I'll put a link in the show notes because I'm all about productivity. How do I get more done with less time?

Karen McCullough:
It's the time management generation. … brought in all of the get stuff done, all of that.

Renee Thompson:
Yes. Yes, that is absolutely.

Karen McCullough:
And you know why? Real quick. Because they wanted to get home to their families, so we talked about work-life balance. So, this is a generation that bucked the baby boomer because they wanted to. And baby boomers, we called them slackers because this is the generation. Remember the word slacker? It was they wanted to get home and watch their kids T-ball game where they wanted to. And so now we are starting to think about. So, it isn't millennials that want a work-life balance. Generation X tried, but they were overpowered. Think about it, yeah.

Renee Thompson:
I still try. I'm still not successful. It makes so much sense. But yeah, the millennials and big hearts, they want purpose, empathy. They're the ones who brought in all those terms compassion and diversity and all of that. And then I never thought of it this way, but this makes a lot of sense. Gen Z, they come in. And I'm thinking of these brand new nurses who come in and right away start saying, This is an issue. That's a problem. Boom, boom, boom, boom. And the leaders, What the heck? And then the baby boomers are like, How dare you? You haven't suffered enough. You haven't put the work in enough to have an opinion here, okay? And then they go back to when I was a new nurse. And then they have all the stories.

Karen McCullough:
It's interesting, isn't it?

Renee Thompson:
It is, it is. And okay, so I want to bring this up because we need your help, Karen. We really need your help. I was just working with a client, and it's in a department where there are a lot of older nurses, veterans, people who've been there forever, and we've lost the middle. So back in the day, especially when I was practicing, we were brand new nurses. Or you had nurses who were maybe five years into their career, you'd have your 8 to 10 years, 15 years, 22. Now it's brand new or you've been there for 35 years, like we've lost the middle. And what comes up all the time is going right back to what you said. Some of the older, and I'm going to say nurses because I see this more in nursing than any other profession, where they are almost to the point where they're attacking the newer nurses instead of helping them. And everybody is so short-staffed right now. Okay. And so the frustration from the leaders is that our experienced, older nurses are eating our young who are then leaving, and then they're complaining about being so short-staffed again. And I don't know, Karen, I'm sure you're seeing this in your work.

Karen McCullough:
There's a lot of reasons for it. When we talk about training right now, we talk about revamping our mindsets. The word mindset is big. I believe that leaders need it more than anyone. And as we're talking about healthcare and nursing right now, you're exactly right. I'm working with a huge team right now, and they told me there's nobody in the middle, right? Either 20 or 40 years, and then you just started. There's a lot of reasons for it. We can blame leadership, but let's just say that's one of the pieces that we have to really retrain our minds. We have to begin to understand that it's not the way; the world is not the same as it was. You've got to get that into your heads. Many of my friends are retired, and they still think the world is the way it was. Why is it like this? It is. If you think about the technology, the world has changed so much in the last ten years. But the other problem that I see is this whole idea of people wanting a life outside of work. So if you think about nursing, if you think about healthcare back 30 years ago, this is where women were. You could either be there, or you can be in education, right? There weren't a lot of options. Today, there's a million options for women. And so they don't have to make a career out of it. They can go do something else. And even in healthcare, they're giving them more options. There's different things coming up in healthcare where they can move on. So it's competitive right now. And I think we have to really, in our hospitals, identify that this is a very competitive place. We are going to do training, we are going to help people shift their mindsets, and we're going to do it through mentoring. We're going to mentorships, but we've got to make a shift. We've got to begin to say, yes, it was like this, but this, and I'm just going to say this, and you could disagree, but maybe it's also better for the patients when we take time off, and we come in with much more energy. So there's going to have to be a rethinking that's going on. I can't say that it's going to be easy like that, but I believe that it has to start with leadership.

Renee Thompson:
I could not agree with you more. And the work that we do addressing disruptive behaviors, cultivating a healthy work culture, we always start with the leadership team first. And I'm going to go back to you. It's not to blame the leaders. It's just we're not equipping the leaders with the knowledge, the skills, and the tools to be able to manage all of this. And a lot of, and this keeps coming up, Karen, a lot of the leaders who are in their roles today became leaders either during COVID, okay? When everything was so urgent, there was no development, no leadership development. You were putting out fires right into it, right in. And now that they're not in crisis mode all the time, they don't even know. Do you ever get to the point where you're so overwhelmed, you have so many things that you need to do, you need to learn, that you get paralyzed and you just stand there? Like, oh my God, I have so many things to do. I have an hour. Which one of these do I tackle? And you get paralyzed by that. I think the leaders are in that same situation where they've got not only running the department, okay, or running their service line, but it's dealing with all of the, I hate to call them people issues. They're not people issues, but they're people. They all like to do that.

Karen McCullough:
I think you've hit it because we've been talking about people. I've been speaking 26 years, 25 years and all. It's always been about life would be, work would be great if it wasn't for the people. That was five years ago someone said that. But I think that the stories, I think we can begin to shift the thinking simply by going through the evolution of the stories and how we got here; number one. Number two, we've got to be curious. We've got to instead of saying, No, give a little time to these younger people. They've got, and they need to be curious about me. I'm going to be honest with you. When I went back to my National Speakers convention, and people realized I'd been doing it for 26 years, it was interesting. I thought they were going to shun me. No, they wanted to know they came up. There was so much curiosity in young speakers. I believe that we have to stimulate that curiosity in our younger nursing and healthcare staff to want to understand the secrets and learn, because there are so many that are there, as we have to stimulate the curiosity in our leaders to begin to take time to understand where they're coming from. Because right now, it's not a right or wrong. We're going to have to. There are so many things that will work, but we have to be open to it because they're going to come up with some new ideas, probably a lot that will save time.

Renee Thompson:
Yeah. So this, you made me think about a conversation I had with someone else, a leader in perioperative services. Her name is Simone. I think her last name is Nichols. I'll actually put the link to that episode because she was on a podcast to that episode in our show notes, but she did something that I thought was really interesting, and what she did as a new leader in this department that had a history of being, let's just say, challenging for leaders and leaders didn't stay there very long. I love this simple, practical idea.

Karen McCullough:
I'm excited to write it down.

Renee Thompson:
Okay, yeah. Get your pen. Because this was so simple that, actually I adopted this, but for a different reason. She had raffle tickets, and she would say to her, people, Τell me one thing about you that I don't know, and I'll give you a raffle ticket. Ask me something about me that you don't know and I'll give you a raffle ticket. And then once a month, I think it was, maybe, she would take all the raffle tickets, and she'd pull one, and whoever's ticket she pulled got a prize. But it's to your point. We tell leaders you have to get to know your people. And I know there's some boundaries there, too much personal, but I think especially, you're talking about the different generations, some of these generations, they'll tell you everything about themselves, sometimes too much. I don't want to know all that about you. They tell you too much. But the reverse, having the younger employees asking the older employees questions about themselves.

Karen McCullough:
I think that is genius, that they have to get a raffle ticket if you ask me something about me, because we're so used to hearing about them. And I'm like, I've got a lot to offer. Somebody asked me, Is it just interesting? I like that idea a lot because that's how we break down the barriers. It's just simple things. It's about learning about people. It's about understanding when someone's a minute late or five minutes late because we know they're getting three kids off to school and they've got things to do, and we've got to begin to understand their life instead of I don't know, I'm sure that the rules are very rigid, but there comes a time when we have to bend a little. And I think that when younger people see the leadership more flexible when we can be flexible when they see that ability to be a little more agile, I feel like we're showing them that we do listen and we are trying. It's that rigidness that is eternal.

Renee Thompson:
Yeah, because I've seen this too, where leaders, we need to set boundaries but at the same time flex, especially with our communication. And I'll give you an example. This comes up here and there with the leaders who I'm working with, where they'll get text messages from their employees Saturday, 2:00 in the morning on a Thursday. And they're like, Hey, I want to change my schedule, or hey, I want to take this to. Things that are not urgent. But what's happening is the leaders are answering them, then complaining about them. I'm like, okay. So we know texting and using all the apps, because I actually did a little, part of a webinar that we did, it was, one of my topics was how to communicate in the multiverse. Okay, you've got all these different ways of communicating. But it's to get really clear on, first of all, don't say no if you want to talk to me; you have to email me or schedule time because that's not going to work, probably for a Gen Z, but to look at the apps and WhatsApp, WhatsApp and all of the different ways, but then also setting some boundaries. If you text me at 2:00 in the morning to ask me to change your schedule, I am not going to respond to you. So I don't know. What's your opinion on that?

Karen McCullough:
My opinion is very clear is set the boundaries. Hey guys, this is what I will answer text, but then don't answer the text or have an answer that comes back. I believe you have to definitely show that you have boundaries. And I think that's another challenge. This isn't happening in healthcare. It's happening in one of the other companies I'm working with, mental health days. So people are taking three mental health days a month or a week, and they're not. So we have to begin to understand that when you don't come to work, it is hurting the team. And we have to set boundaries. Even though we say we want to improve, we want this. Nothing works without boundaries.

Renee Thompson:
Yeah, I think you're right. A lot of leaders struggle with that. I know personally I struggle with it too. I sometimes struggle setting those boundaries with even my own clients. Because I'll be at the gym, I'll be in a fitness class, it'll be 7:30 at night, and I get a text message from one of my clients, and I'm answering it, and I'm stepping out to hop on a call.

Karen McCullough:
It's because you're a Gen X. You would not answer it if you were a millennial, for sure. You would have the boundaries. This is not my work time. We, as baby boomers and Gen X, we're going to bend over backwards and do that and setting boundaries even though we're like, Darn it, why do they do that? We're still going to give in. But a younger generation is not going to give in. They have a very clear boundaries of work and their personal life.

Renee Thompson:
That's so funny. I never even considered that. And that's what I really appreciate about your expertise in understanding and having that curiosity.

Karen McCullough:
Yes. And also make, laughing at yourself. I would help people, I've worked all day, and my youngest, Hey, I had my retail stores, and my younger employees would say, But nobody asked you to why. We can get it done. And you realize you're right, but we have this desire to please, this desire to do it right, this desire. And that is part of our and your generational story. It's a part of our work ethic that doesn't serve us anymore. I hate to say it, but we've got to begin to look at things like that. Is it serving me right now? Because I'm learning from younger people. I'm learning that I am much better when I take the weekend off and I come in, rather than trying to get a lot of work done on the weekend, and then coming in on Monday and working. So we can learn. I wish I could solve the nursing problem. I wish I could wave a magic wand. I can't. It's a tough one, but I believe that we've got to begin to identify ourselves and look at what makes us tick, begin to bring those boundaries in, begin to bring in that compassion, that teaching piece of us. And I believe that I liked what you said. We've got to make work pleasant. People need to want to come to work. And so we have to begin to understand the environment that we're creating. It's hard. We don't have really any place else to go, Renee. We can't afford to lose more people.

Renee Thompson:
We can't. And I ask a lot of the people who were working with, okay, especially when we start working with them and we implement one of our systems. It's called a department culture change initiative, and we are with them for a year. And at the beginning, we always say, at the end of this year, what's one thing you'd like to see as a result of our work? One change. And you know what they say, Karen? I want this to be a fun, I want this to be a place where people want to work. I want people to feel good about coming into work, that they're looking forward to coming into work. And then there's a lot of the respectful communication, I wish we could just get rid of the gossip, but the underlying theme in all of it is I want people to want to come to work. That's the feeling I want to create.

Karen McCullough:
When you go into a department, you can feel where people want to be there, you can feel where there's energy. And there's always a person, we've got to look for the strength in our team. There's always going to be that person. I know if I was on the team, it would be me.

Renee Thompson:
Yes, yes.

Karen McCullough:
Who is that energy? Who does bring that? It doesn't have to come from you. Look at the strengths of your team and begin to have a conversation. Let's be more. Let's make people want to come in. Let's remember some of the important. Life, what am I trying to say: birthdays and holidays, whatever. And he said people bring with them into work. Let's try to be more personal without crossing the boundary.

Renee Thompson:
One of our strategies that we actually then have this is how you do this is building relationships with the people who you work with and not just nursing to nursing, but it's the whole interprofessional team and getting to know each other because once something about them from beyond the work, beyond the scrubs, beyond the stethoscope, I don't know. I always say it's harder to be mean to someone if you understand and know them. If you know something about it.

Karen McCullough:
It's a little bit of, we get to know you a little bit more and a little bit more, and I believe that it's part of this. It's building a culture where people want to come to work every day. It's building a culture where we care about each other, where our department cares, and we care about our patients, but we also care about each other. And sometimes it's a culture where we have to bend a little, give a little because maybe we know we're going to get it back. We're not doing it for that. I didn't mean to say it that way, but you know what I'm saying?

Renee Thompson:
Yeah, it always comes back. Your kindness is always returned. And I think that's so powerful. And instead of I see and hear a lot of people complaining about the different generations, they complain about the Gen Zs, they complain about the millennials. But Karen, sounds like what you're saying is, first of all, stop complaining about them. Okay?

Karen McCullough:
I'll learn from them. I learn so much. Learn from them. Tell me about that. Because their, everything is so completely different from what I do. It's so interesting because this is what I do every day and what I learned when I'm giving a comp; they'll come up and say, Don't say this. Or Hey, use this song. I'm getting so much content from Gen Z, but it's because I believe that I'm showing them that I'm open. I try to be relevant. I try to be open because that's the way I'm going to learn. And it's their world. It's, every day, it's we're getting after Gen Z's, Gen Alpha. So, you millennials, those are your kids. And I wonder what they're going to be like because they're listening to their, and they're watching their iPods or iPads. Excuse me when they're two, it will be a different world. So we've got to prepare for it. We've got to change. And the older we are, the more open we have to be, the more we have to evolve, and the more curious we have to be. And then the last piece is we've got to keep learning. Yes, we have to keep learning about healthcare, but we also have to keep learning about each other. And we have to keep learning about ways that we can connect in a meaningful way.

Renee Thompson:
Wow. Karen, this was fantastic. And I feel like we probably could have spent a couple of hours on this topic. But if you had to, as we wrap up here, if you had to just summarize it into 1 or 2 things that leaders can do right now, like some practical strategies that they can go, you know, back to work to really start embracing and learning from all the different the gifts that these different generations can potentially bring us, what would you suggest?

Karen McCullough:
I would suggest all of the responsibilities you have, all of the technology, right, now it's time to be more human. And I believe that it's time to be flexible where you can be, to be a good listener, to take in things. It doesn't mean you have to change and you have to go change right away. But you can say, Yeah, I hear you. I get your point of view. People need to feel heard. When we feel heard, when we feel seen, we can begin to build a culture where people want to come to work every day. So it's the human skills. You're in a human business. You are in this whole idea of humanity. Let's bring it into the workplace.

Renee Thompson:
Wow, I love that. It's funny, I had a little internal chuckle because the work that we do behavior, sometimes it's referred to as the soft skills. They don't want to focus on that because they have, they want to look at clinical care and competence and technology and all of that, how important they are, and it's equally as important. And I like your phrase better: human skills.

Karen McCullough:
The human skills. Bringing humanity back into the culture. What's going to keep people? People are going to, people, we want to feel a part of something. Oh my gosh, I love my team at work. I enjoy going in every day. We've got to begin to bring that back. And maybe it was COVID; who knows? We can blame it on so many things. But now is the time to start. Now is the time to start.

Renee Thompson:
I think that's just spot on and exactly what is needed right now. And if I had to sum up everything that you said it would be, Leaders need to be curious and they need to learn from, I'm not going to say the younger generations, because you may be listening to this as a leader and you may be a Gen Z right now or a millennial. You need to let the older generations then, like we just need to learn from each other.

Karen McCullough:
We need to learn from each other because there's so many gifts that we can give each other from experience. I just told somebody I think I've lived through 12 recessions, and I'm still standing. I learned how to do that. Do you want to know how? I think there's so much that we can share and help people with right now, and there's so much that I can learn from those Gen Z's. I used to be afraid of you, Gen Z, but I'm not anymore.

Renee Thompson:
Now, we embrace you. We welcome you. Teach us something that'll make our lives better.

Karen McCullough:
And I understand you. Understand that they're are the children of Gen X. It made it all very clear to me. I began to understand it better.

Renee Thompson:
That is so funny. Thank you so much, Karen. Okay. If people want to connect with you, what's the best way they can connect with you?

Karen McCullough:
Oh, you can email me at [email protected]. I'm on LinkedIn. It's Karen McCullough. I love LinkedIn. And I think those are the best ways. I have a website. You can go hop on it and look at it and let's get connected.

Renee Thompson:
Yes, I, first of all, I love your website. I think it's so well done. I've been on your website before, but I went back on it. I love, so Karen has a blog. She has, she does a lot of keynotes. There's a lot of information on her website. But your keynotes, I chuckled, I love this. You have a keynote titled: It's not personal, it's generational.

Karen McCullough:
It's hooked a lot. Because if I can make people laugh, they want to come. Because I can say generational this or that, but that title, I'm going to make you laugh. I'm going to make you laugh at yourself. And I'm going to, we're going to take a stroll down memory lane for just a little bit to talk about those generational stories and then begin to feel how can we now grow our workplace and our culture.

Renee Thompson:
Yeah, I loved it. I thought it was a great title, and I read the description. I'm like, this is spot on. So, if you're a leader right now and you're struggling with generational challenges, I highly recommend that you connect with Karen, and you can have Karen come to your place and not only help your leaders to be more curious and to learn, but to have a good time. Okay, because yeah, Karen's a lot of fun. I think you'd really love spending some time with her. So again, I appreciate it. Thank you so much for being here, Karen.

Karen McCullough:
Thanks. Thank you. Thanks, everybody. Thanks for listening.

Renee Thompson:
Thank you. Yeah, thanks to the listeners. We know you're very busy, but really appreciate you giving us your time today. And just so appreciate everything you're doing to try to become a better leader so that you can cultivate a healthier work culture. And if you really like this podcast, if you could give us a rating, and post a review, and then share it with others who may need to hear this today? Thanks, everyone. Take care.

Renee Thompson:
Thank you for listening to Coffee Break: Breaking the Cycle of Bullying in Healthcare – One Cup at a Time. If you found this podcast helpful, we invite you to click the Subscribe button and tune in every week. For more information about our show and how we work with healthcare organizations to cultivate and sustain a healthy work culture free from bullying and incivility, visit us at HealthyWorkforceInstitute.com. Until our next cup of coffee, be kind, take care, and stay connected.

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